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one and one and one is three...

got to be good looking 'cause he's so hard to see

Hello, and welcome, class, to HEJ's superfun knitting math class. For those of you who don't care about math, here is an update of my jaywalker's, mostly for Cara's bloggy enjoyment. It'll be over soon, Cara!

jaywalkeralmostdone.jpg

Note that I have finally reached the heel, despite frogging six inches of sock. Whew. Note that the patterns sort of match now. Double whew.

Funny thing about these also, I started them as typical for me on dpns, then I tried two circ's for the first time, but I didn't like it cause of all the jangly needle ends. Then I tried the MAGIC LOOP, and I love it, except when this happened...

magicloopgoneawry.jpg
Hahahahaha. Not really all that funny, actually.

I think I will mostly use the magic loop from now on. I really like it. Fewer joins, less likely to fall out. I thank the lug who's post made me want to try it.

Knit It! Shrug (Fisherman Shrug) Q and A.

Many have written to me about my Knit It! Shrug (Spring/Summer 2006) for help, after I let the cat out of the bag about the pattern problems. Here's a very mathy explanation that may or may not help, but will let you know what you are up against. Those who don't care, skip. I'll see you later!

I'm going to break down the problems with the pattern in a few steps.

A) Typos: Back

The directions tell you to work until piece measures 8 (10"). Note on the green "back" diagram the vertical distance they show you is 7.5". ????. That's right. 7.5" is not either 8 or 10".

B) Typos: Sleeve

1) If you knit the sleeve until it measures 16" (17") I guarantee unless you are a gorilla these will be too long. WAY too long. Adjust based on your size.

The way I did it was to cast on 34 (36) stitches in a provisional way, decrease as directed for the raglan, then pick the provisional stitches up and DECREASE down to the ribbing, adjusting the size to fit.

2) If you do the decreases for the raglan sleeve as they call for, there is no way you can be left with 16 (18) stitches. You will be left with SIX stitches for each size. However, if you look at the shrug itself it's clear this is too narrow, they want you to have 16 (18) left at the end.

What I did:
CO provisional 34 (36) stitches (as I did) or knit one row.
Purl one row.
Row 3: k1, ssk, k to last 3 sts, k2tog, k1
Rows 4-6: work even st st.
Repeat rows 3-6 five more times.
Decrease as for row 3 every other row three times more (six rows total). Place stitches on holder.

Note that your row gauge may alter this. See "B" below.

3) Third typo - see the purple diagram for the sleeve? See how the top (raglan) is shaped, with the sides marked "front" and "back" not equal in slope? This CANNOT be true if you decrease the way they say. If you decrease one stitch each side, by definition that is an isoceles trapezoid. It must be. Just FYI. Here it is in picture format:

shrugsleevediagram.jpg

B) TYPOs. FRONTS.

If you decrease the way they recommend, 18 (20) stitches CANNOT leave you with 1 stitch. Unless you can bend math to your will (which maybe only Heather with her aerospace skills or Stephanie with her space-time-warp skills can do), you are out of luck.

It will leave you with 4 stitches. I then decreased these to 3 with a K1, K2tog, K1, and bound off.


C) Row gauge, and why for this sweater you MUST swatch, and MUST care.

Row gauge in this shrug is EXTREMELY important. I can't emphasize this enough. Why? The reason is that your vertical distance will matter with pieces that are triangles, etc. Look below:

triangles.jpg

Even though the triangle A and the triangle B have the very same STITCH gauge, and therefore the same width, if the row gauge is not the same, heights "A" and "B" will not be the same. Because the pieces all have triangular parts, in order to match them up and fit you, this must be accurate.

Herein lies the biggest problem: You must get a gauge of 10 rows to 4 inches as the pattern wants (or 2.5 rows to the inch), so the math will work.

For example, if you knit the Front pieces for the small size as they describe, it will take 17 rows to go from row 1 to four stitches. Let's make it 19 rows by purling the next row, then decreasing one more stitch the next row as I mentioned above. If you call it 20 rows with the bind off, 20 rows at 2.5 rows/inch is 8" tall. (20/2.5 = 8)

The diagram states the triangle looks like this:

trianglevertheight.jpg

By the Pythagorean Theorem, X must be 8.06" because:

X = sq root [(9x9)-(4X4)] which is 8.06". Which is essentially just 8". And that's great.

But, see how if your row gauge is off at all, (which for my yarn was 13 rows to 4 " at correct stitch gauge), your pieces will not have the vertical or diagonal heights they need?

Even if your row gauge is correct, other diagonal and vertical numbers are off on their diagrams and pattern, if you check them all out, so you might still have to manipulate them.

I redid the math for each geometric piece to fit my recipient, and to fit together. If you get all this knitting geometry and have some experience, you can do it. One way that might help is using the suggested yarn, "Wool-Ease Thick and Quick", but that yarn states a row gauge of 12 rows = 4 inches, so you'll have to try it to see. I didn't use it, and don't know if i will work.

If not, you may decide it is too much work, and no one will blame you... I am not trying to dissuade all of you, but you shouldn't knit like a fiend and have it not work in the end. THAT's frustrating.

I hope this has been helpful. All I know is, my brain hurts. Time for a nap. ;-)

Comments

Thank you for finally answering that age-old question heard in high schools across the country: When will I *ever* need to know the Pythagorean theorem in real life? You rock.

You are the Math Queen.

Magic Loop rules. I hate DPN's. I Magic Loop everything now. I tried to Magic Loop my dog's leash yesterday. He didn't like it.

All hail Magic Loop! All hail HEJ, Math Queen!

Oh, by the way your Jaywalkers are GORGEOUS.

I think I need to lie down now. Too many numbers. I thought I could handle it but clearly I'm a dreamer.

Hi Jenny - I'm glad to spread the magic loop love. I am magic loop-ing my tubey now.

Since you're in the medical field I have a question for you - do you feel that there is a stomach flu epidemic this year? Every blog I read, someone has the stomach flu and my office has been hit with it off and on this year. Thought I'd get your professional opinion!

And your Jaywalkers look good!

:)

While knitting math hurts my head, I still like to learn about how it works, so thanks!

Jay walkers lookin' good...

Merci Beaucoup for the shrug info. I'll think long and hard on this one...although this might be the perfect entry for my little Lion olympics...certainly challenging!

Oh Sweet Jenny! They look great! I'm a two circ girl myself but whatever works for you. Oh and I skipped the math stuff, so thanks for the pretty picture.

You need to write math questions for the GRE. The knitters would *so* rock it if you did.

And also, the Jaywalkers are so much beautiful. I LOVE.

DAMMIT...I knew that about the decreases on the front...did the same thing...great minds eh?

But they are 5 inches...not 8! rip rip. damned row gauge. I printed out this entry...cause I'm doing the sleeves tonight.

damn you Knit (sh)it! Cool...thanks babycakes!

Hello, Cliff's notes for geometry and trig. You just wrote them, I hope you get royalties from Cliff, if that is a person. If it is not, might I suggest you change your name to Cliff?

Wow, I wish I hadn't been stoned for high school geometry. I may give it a try with much help from my extremely helpful LYS lady. Thank you very much. You are truly a knitting guru.

thank you so much. i am NOT a math person. NOT. so, this would have been thrown and never looked at again! i appreciate this soo much

And once again the words of my glib 16 year old self come back to haunt me, "Mr. Fischer I will never use geometry in everyday life"! I figured out the front and back, but I've had one sleeve cuff on needles and have been looking at the diagram, reading the instructions, scratching my head and saying "WHAT?" Now I can finish this darn thing that I started as an easy weekend project a month ago! Thank you!

Yep - just as I thought - was in the process of figuring out the sleeve decreases, when I thought I would google finished bolero's.

Thanks for doing the job for me.

Can you believe such an easy freaking sweater to write out and knit can have so many errors?

Yeah!
I knew I'd find someone online who was also irritated by the idiocies in the fisherman shrug pattern-- you described the problems just the way I was writing it in my head while I was knitting. It is ending up with arms like a gorilla, but I frogged and fussed the triangles into behaving....

:-)

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